TRANSCRIPT
Office Ladies | Episode 312 - Jenny Slate
Jenna [00:00:04] I'm Jenna Fischer,
Angela [00:00:05] and I'm Angela Kinsey.
Jenna [00:00:06] We were on "The Office" together,
Angela [00:00:08] and we're best friends.
Jenna [00:00:09] And now we're doing the ultimate Office lover's podcast, just for you.
Angela [00:00:13] Each week we will dive deeper into the world of The Office with exclusive interviews, behind the scenes details, and lots of BFF stories.
Jenna [00:00:21] We're the Office Ladies 6.0.
Jenna [00:00:01] Jenny!
Angela [00:00:00] Hi!
Jenny [00:00:01] Hello, ladies.
Angela [00:00:03] Oh lady. Welcome to the podcast
Jenny [00:00:06] Thank you. How many people come on this show and are freaking out that they get to talk to you, in the way that I am?
Angela [00:00:14] Oh, that's very nice. I don't ever feel that. We think we're just two kind of dorky gals that like to hang out. So, thank you for saying that. We're so thrilled to meet you! We're such big fans.
Jenna [00:00:23] I really am a big fan of yours. This is-
Jenny [00:00:26] This is so nice.
Jenna [00:00:26] I've always hoped that one of these many industry events that I would maybe cross paths with you and I never have, but I really admire you so much and so this is exciting.
Jenny [00:00:39] Oh, same here. Your work has brought me so much joy. And again I wonder, I'm like, "Did everybody just say the same things?" Because you're just so significant to a large group of people. But truly, this is a fricking trip, man. It really is for me.
Angela [00:00:56] We can't wait to talk to you and we kick off our show with a chitchat suggestion from an Office Ladies fan We have one today from Haley H.. Let's hear from her:
Haley H. [00:01:07] Hi Office Ladies, a long time listener here, big fan of the podcast. I have a chit chat question for you. My husband and I just celebrated our one year wedding anniversary. We bought our home just a couple months before we got married. So we've been nesting here for just over a year now. When we moved in, I had the honor and privilege of deciding where all of the items in our kitchen belonged and found their home in place. It was a wonderful task that I thoroughly enjoyed getting to do. However, this has caused some points of contention between my husband and I, in terms of where some items truly belong. An example of this has to do with the potato peeler. Now I place items based on function. So the potato peel for me goes in what I call the kitchen gadget or utility drawer. So this drawer houses items such as some measuring cups, my immersion blender, it has my lemon squeezer, and other various items as such. Kitchen utilities. Well, my husband likes to organize items based on, I guess the material that they're made out of. Because potato peeler has a blade he likes to put it in the cutlery drawer, where we house some of our knives. Every time I see it put there I just have to take a deep breath and I move it just slightly back into the kitchen utility drawer. So my question for you all is what are some items in your house where it is a hill that you will die on, in terms of where they are properly stored and organized in your home. Whether it's another item in your kitchen or perhaps a different place inside your house, what are some items that are a strong hill for you? And perhaps maybe you've been challenged, by either a spouse or a child, in terms of where that item truly belongs. If I get a Jenna rant out of this, that is huge cherry on top. I love hearing those from her, but I'm just looking forward to hearing your answers here. Alright, take care, love you, bye.
Angela [00:03:32] That was such a detailed, thoughtful question.
Jenna [00:03:36] Very thorough.
Jenny [00:03:37] Yeah, I understand it.
Jenna [00:03:39] It did make my blood boil several times, so you are correct. It brought some things up for me personally, but I'll let you guys go first.
Angela [00:03:48] I mean, Jenny, you're our guest, you get to go. How do you feel about where things are placed in the kitchen?
Jenna [00:03:53] Or home.
Angela [00:03:54] Or home, yeah, we can open this up.
Jenny [00:03:57] First of all, I really understand the predicament and the ongoing back and forth. I'm the person that - I love unpacking as well, and I love moving. I know some people think that's freakish, but I really enjoy it. I unpacked our whole kitchen when my family moved last fall. I get insecure about feeling controlling, but I cook every day. I cook a lot. I've been asked by family members to bake less because apparently there's too many treats. If the person who unpacked it and placed it there kind of feels like that should sort of be where it lies. But the other thing I'll say is, I don't really understand putting a potato peeler with blades. I feel like it's just sort of a general utensil. I would just put it with the can opener, is what I would say.
Angela [00:04:47] Like utility, like she was saying.
Jenny [00:04:48] Utility, yeah. But I also don't really, (I mean, this isn't a criticism of Haley) but I put all the baking things in one place, but that's because I really need them to be separate because I use them a lot. But you know what mine is for me? It's the screen door, which I know is not necessarily an object or item that you might think of, but I need that to be shut. And it's not getting shut. It's crazy to me. I don't understand why you would leave it open when the whole point of it is to shut it so that you don't get bugs in the house. It kills me.
Angela [00:05:20] [laughing] I love that. You know, here's the thing. Jenna knows this. Jenny, I am not the cook in my house. My husband's a baker and a chef. So he bakes a ton. So, he has his baking area. The kitchen really makes sense to him. It's like that scene in "Good Will Hunting" where there's all the equations on the chalkboard and he's like, "I just see it." That's how Josh is about the kitchen. I'm like, "I don't get it. I don t understand why the seasoning needs to go here." And he s like, "How can you not?" So I'm probably the wrong person to ask this question, because I'll just be like, "If you want the forks to go there and that's important for you, the forks will go there d**n it." But for me, he doesn't shut a single cabinet.
Jenny [00:06:04] You gotta shut those.
Angela [00:06:05] No cabinets. No, I just walk through like Vanna White, all day. I'm just shutting things all day. I'm, like, "Why?" The dishwasher this morning, he just left it open. He left it open. Someone's gonna fall and chip a tooth.
Jenny [00:06:20] It's like there's a ghost. That's how it feels to me, when the cabinets are open. It's like a ghost came in and they were like, "I just need you to know I'm still here." So they left a cabinet open. Shut it, man.
Angela [00:06:34] Shut it already. Alright, Jenna, what about you?
Jenna [00:06:35] Okay, I know what mine is. So in our kitchen by our back door, we have... It's called the junk drawer, but I don't like it to be called that because to me it is our highly organized miscellaneous drawer. So I need three things to be in this drawer. My husband and I only agree about one of them. This is the sort of thing, like, when I open this drawer and one of my items, one of three essentials, is not in the drawer, I have to take deep breaths and remind myself that he's a good man and he does so many wonderful things and that he loves me very much. So that I don't go off. Here's what I need in that drawer: I need Band-Aids. Because it's the first step: if you're outside and you skin a knee, as soon as you walk in the house, this the closest drawer to that skinned knee. So I need Band-Aids in there. We agree on this, Band-aids live there. Here are the other two things I need in there: I need a measuring tape. My husband thinks the measuring tape goes in the garage. The garage is not attached to our house.
Angela [00:07:41] It's far, it's not -
Jenny [00:07:42] That's too far.
Jenna [00:07:44] I like to measure things. I measure things more often than maybe you would think. I'm constantly wondering like, "Oh, could we put this picture here? Or could we move a chair here?" And I measure. I'm a pre-measure. I don't just move stuff.
Jenny [00:07:59] Cool, okay.
Jenna [00:08:00] So I need my measuring tape there.
Angela [00:08:01] I didn't know any of this about her, Jenny. We've been friends a long time. I didn't know band-aids and measuring tape go in the same drawer. Okay, go.
Jenna [00:08:08] The other thing that I need in there is packing tape. Again, my husband is always putting the measuring tape and the packing tape out in the garage. But you know what he puts in the drawer? This is the thing where I feel like I look at him and I'm like, "I don't know who you are. I don't understand you." He has seven different screwdrivers and two needle nose pliers,
Angela [00:08:30] They don't go in the garage?!
Jenna [00:08:32] Thank you!
Jenny [00:08:33] Yeah.
Jenna [00:08:34] Thank you! Two needle-nose pliers! I just cleaned out the drawer again and I said, "Babe, do we need both needle-nose pliers in here? Like, when's the last time you were like, 'Oh, I need some needle-nose pliers and I need them quick. I need to be really close, like, in the kitchen.' I mean, when did you use these last?"
Jenny [00:08:50] And double. What, did he have one in each hand?
Jenna [00:08:52] Exactly! They're the same size, one wasn't tinier than the other and all the screwdrivers. Similarly, I said, "How many of these screwdrivers are we using on a weekly basis? Zero." I think that tools can be out in the garage but the packing tape, that I use on almost every other day, and the measuring tape (because I love to measure) and the band-aids we need those in the drawer.
Angela [00:09:16] Throw this out there to you because -
Jenna [00:09:17] I'm Haley. Haley and I get along.
Jenny [00:09:18] Yeah, I mean, this is so funny how this question really fired me up. I really want the things in my kitchen to stay where they are. I just want them to stay right where they, especially the sponge. That's the other one.
Angela [00:09:31] By the sink?
Jenna [00:09:31] Is your a sponge moving around?
Jenny [00:09:33] It's moving around, it's not getting squeezed out.
Angela [00:09:36] I hate it when people leave it in the sink. I'm like, "No."
Jenny [00:09:39] Oh, it's gross.
Angela [00:09:40] "Don't do that." Wait, always, our sound engineer Sam and our producer Matt weigh in on this, too. So Sam, what do you got?
Sam [00:09:47] Nothing, I'm completely malleable. Move me, I don't have any need.
Angela [00:09:51] [surprised] Sam. Wow.
Sam [00:09:53] Mi casa su casa, yeah.
Jenna [00:09:54] Not attached to where things live.
Sam [00:09:57] Nope.
Angela [00:09:58] Okay. Alright.
Jenna [00:09:58] That sounds healthy.
Angela [00:09:58] It does, it sounds really zen. Matt Beagle?
Matt [00:10:02] I grew up in a house where we put cups and glasses in a drawer. People think that's really weird but it's just what I'm used to, so I like cups in a drawer. But that's unpopular, I think.
Jenny [00:10:14] Cubs in a drawer is, it's surprising because you don't think they're going to be there. So sometimes it's just harder to find.
Matt [00:10:18] It's just what I'm used to with this from childhood. I don't feel super strongly about it. I'm just kind of used to it.
Angela [00:10:24] I'm going to throw this out there. One more thing. I didn't realize how passionate I am about this stuff, especially since I'm someone who doesn't really care about kitchen things. But when the kids were little and we were encouraging them to help at dinnertime set the table, we had these lower drawers in the kitchen that we put plates and cups in that were plastic. And they could then set their place at the table. They got really excited about that. Now they're in high school, they're driving, they're teenagers, but they still want those cups and plates in the lower drawer. Cause they use them; they grab them for snacks, like apple slices or M&Ms or peanuts. I know someday the lower drawer won't be full of the plastic cups and plate, and I'm already sad about it. I'm sorry, I have kids that are now seniors and Jenny, all this stuff is coming up. I'm like, "Someday there's not gonna be the drawer."
Jenna [00:11:16] But Lady, then you're going to be a grandma and it's going to be filled with all those cups again,
Angela [00:11:21] Oh gosh, I hope not for a bit.
Jenna [00:11:21] Don't worry. Just keep 'em there.
Jenny [00:11:25] My daughter's five, she's starting kindergarten next week, two weeks from now. I actually used a measuring tape this morning to measure her.
Angela [00:11:33] Yes, like by the back door?
Jenny [00:11:35] I measured her whole body. No because, I wear a bathrobe every morning. I wear like a beautiful, cotton bathrobe. Not a fluffy one, it's almost like a kimono but it's not silky. But anyway, she's like, "I want a bathrobe" and we couldn't figure out what size she would be and so I measured her arms and her legs. They're just all tiny. Like, 16 inches, she's so small.
Jenna [00:12:01] Alright, well, Haley, thank you so much for sending in your question. You got a lot of strong feelings from a lot people.
Angela [00:12:07] Yeah, that was fun.
Jenna [00:12:08] Alright. Well, listen, why don't we take a break and then we're gonna come back and we're going to talk more with Jenny.
Angela [00:12:13] Yay!
audio cue [00:12:17] [musical sting]
Angela [00:12:17] Alright, you guys, we are back with Jenny Slate. Jenny, you have a new animated movie coming out. It's called "Forgotten Island." It's in theaters now, right?
Jenny [00:12:28] Yes, yes it is. My character, she's a spirit and you can't really tell, she good or bad? We will see. Somehow I'm always in that. I get put in that zone a lot, of playing the problematic person.
Angela [00:12:42] The baddie? Same. Same, Jenny.
Jenny [00:12:45] Right? Of course. It's very opposite of how I see myself. Maybe the first time it happened was on "The Kroll Show?" Where Nick Kroll and I were playing these kind of silly women who are both named Liz, who were idiots. But then they ratcheted it up on "Parks and Rec" with Mona Lisa, who's described as the worst person in the world.
Angela [00:13:05] Oh my gosh, that is one of my favorite characters. Mona Lisa, you and Ben Schwartz together.
Jenny [00:13:11] It's so cool. I love it. In Forgotten Island, the character I play, Batiba, she's very cute and sweet and lonely. In general, the movie is really funny and quite beautiful. I'm a big animation fan, so it's...I don't know, [chuckles] it's an honor.
Angela [00:13:26] It's very magical. There's these two best friends and they fall through this portal and they get stuck on this forgotten island. Visually, it's just beautiful and so colorful and the creatures they encounter are otherworldly and really cool looking.
Jenny [00:13:41] Yeah, it's a total trip. Not just into the imagination, but it's a very interesting metaphor for what it's like to move from your teenage years into the world at large and adulthood, and will you hold on to your childhood relationships? These are things that I'm constantly fascinated by. Also, my character (as I said) is really lonely and afraid to go outside. And I don't know why I became this way, but I've always been really concerned with like, "How do you make those things not something we laugh at, but something that can make us laugh so we can kind of get enough relief so that we can find better options for how to deal with it?"
Angela [00:14:23] Yeah, or have empathy, right? And be like, "Oh, I remember a time like that in my life, too." Yeah.
Jenny [00:14:29] Yeah.
Jenna [00:14:30] I'm really excited to see this movie with my daughter. She's starting middle school. Similar to in this movie (I mean, the characters are a little older in this movie, one of them is going off to college) but my daughter's entering middle school, and there's a lot of new friendships that are formed and friend groups shift. Who was your best friend from kindergarten might not actually end up being your best friend when you graduate as a senior. And so, I think that's a really cool part of this movie is just... How friendships move and transition.
Jenny [00:15:03] Yeah, I watch a lot of animated stuff with my daughter. She's five, and I think it won't be too scary for her to see, but I also think my nieces and nephews who are older (they're high schoolers), I think they'll really enjoy it. That's kind of a score for me, that I can take them to a movie that I'm in. Quite honestly.
Angela [00:15:21] Oh huge, yeah.
Jenna [00:15:23] Have you shown your daughter any of the other animated films that you have voiced a character for?
Jenny [00:15:29] I have, she appears to find "Zootopia" to be too scary, which I understand.
Jenna [00:15:35] At five, I get that.
Jenny [00:15:36] Yeah, she gets scared of conflict, which don't we all, you know? She's a little bit afraid of "The Secret Life of Pets" because the dogs don't get along at first, and she thinks that's too tough. But weirdly, she's into "Inside Out." When it's someone in an emotional struggle, she's like, "I can understand, I'll plug in." But when it's just someone being like, "I don't want you to be here," it hurts her feelings too much, which I... I'm kind of like, "That's great." But she has seen "The Lorax." I was the mom in The Lorax, also starring your co-star, Ed Helms.
Angela [00:16:06] Yes.
Jenny [00:16:06] Ed Helms, who is one of my dear friends and comes for Thanksgiving every year, the last few years.
Angela [00:16:10] Oh, that is so lovely.
Jenna [00:16:11] I love that. Aw, Ed Helms, who has two daughters of his own.
Jenny [00:16:16] Big time.
Angela [00:16:16] My kids actually were - Well listen, they're teenagers now and they're very excited that I'm meeting you because they think you're cool, right?
Jenny [00:16:25] Oh, that's nice.
Angela [00:16:25] I'm not cool, but you're cool. But they did say (they obviously know a lot of your credits because they're older now) but one movie that was on repeat (because we had the DVD of it and we had the minivan with the fold down little movie player that you put the DVD in on road trips) that they watched was "Alvin and the Chipmunks: Chipwrecked,"
Jenny [00:16:47] Oh my god.
Angela [00:16:48] Over and over and so they were like, "Oh my gosh, will you tell her we loved her in Alvin and the Chipmunks: Chipwrecked? And so I promised them I would tell you that.
Jenny [00:16:58] Tell them I said thank you. That was, I think, my first movie I was ever in.
Angela [00:17:02] And, again, you're the baddie!
Jenny [00:17:05] I know! It's actually weird! I had forgotten, honestly. That movie's wild. I don't exactly remember the plot, but I kind of feel like I'm spoofing Tom Hanks in "Castaway." My memory of making that movie is like... I had never made a movie before. From what I... Yeah, I think it was my first. I had been fired from SNL. I was like, "How am I gonna get a job?" And then they were like, "There's this movie, Alvin and the Chipmunks." I'm like, "Cool, great." Then I had also never worked with a green screen or any special effects. The chipmunks aren't there, spoiler for that, but they're not real. And it already was a sensitive time in my life because I was like, "Am I ever going to act again? What happened?" And then just making the movie was genuinely very fun. It was a lot of me in a studio in Vancouver talking to a tennis ball on a stick. I hope that doesn't show in the performance, but.
Angela [00:18:01] No, not at all. You totally sell it.
Jenny [00:18:03] And then we had a few weeks in Hawaii and my parents came to visit, just to make sure that I was okay.
Jenna [00:18:11] You got a free trip to Hawaii out of it, which is always fun. When a movie or a project takes you somewhere cool.
Angela [00:18:18] I know.
Jenny [00:18:18] Oh, yeah. It was so cool. God, that's such a plus. It's all a dream. I don't know what your experience of being in the entertainment industry is. But for me, it just has not worn off. It just hasn't worn off that I'm like, "This is so -"
Angela [00:18:33] Cool.
Jenny [00:18:34] "Nice." Yeah.
Jenna [00:18:36] You've done so many things, Jenny. I mean, you are an actress, but you're also a comedian, but you've also written books, but you also are now a podcaster. I'm very curious. Take me back to the beginning. Where did you grow up? And at what point did you realize, "I wanna be an entertainer?"
Jenny [00:18:53] Well, I'm from Milton, Massachusetts, which is six miles south of Boston. That's where my family is from. I have two sisters, my parents are both artists. My mom is a potter and my dad is a poet. We would rent movies from the library. One of my dad's friends got us a VCR and we rented movies from the library. I really can't remember a time that I didn't want to be an actor. I really, really wanted to. A lot of that was based off of watching Judy Garland and Gene Kelly, but also Sesame Street movies, like "Follow That Bird." If anyone remembers that movie, it was so good. Shirley Temple, which I'm not sure those films have aged well and I'm not sure I could recommend them. Maybe not the most sensitive appropriate films anymore, But at the time it was like... Mostly, I just liked that she was a little girl and she had tap shoes and she had a big lollipop. And I always wanted to be a performer. But my parents were like, "You can do that in school. You can be in the plays and stuff," and I did speech team. I was on our speech and debate team. But they were just like, "You're not gonna do that until you go to college." It was kind of understood. I didn't really realize that there were tracks. Like, this person is a comedian or this person does dramatic acting. I kind of thought you could just do everything. Because there also were actors that did that, like Carol Burnett, for example. I really loved her so much. For me, her playing Miss Hannigan in "Annie" was really scary.
Angela [00:20:25] Yeah.
Jenny [00:20:26] And really dramatic. And yeah, it never occurred to me that you might have to separate it out. One of my life's dreams was to be on "Saturday Night Live." I watched all the tapes of Gilda Radner and I was obsessed with Gilda Radner. I went to Columbia. I graduated and started doing standup with my best friend, Gabe Liedman. And that's kind of how my career started. I got a manager who helped me get commercials.
Angela [00:20:50] What was one of your earliest commercials? Because that was my route. I did tons of commercials and so I love seeing people in old commercials.
Jenny [00:20:57] First of all, I didn't book a lot. Did you ever book those ones that were called "industrials?"
Angela [00:21:04] Oh yeah. Oh yeah, I did.
Jenny [00:21:05] It was a lot of that.
Angela [00:21:08] Yeah, I did one (I think it was for Ford) and I had to talk about the... I don't know, it was something in the engine. I was so bad, it was really bad.
Jenny [00:21:20] Yeah, I mean, I feel like commercials are genuinely very hard. You have to be so normal, often about something that's not very exciting. It's one thing if you're you, as you, endorsing a toothbrush that you actually use, which I have done. And I'm like, "I love this toothbrush. I really like it! For my teeth, as Jenny." But I remember doing a Cascade commercial. That's the one I really remember. For reasons that I'll never understand, they gave me super long extensions. Also, I didn't have a dishwasher. You know, I had a tiny apartment in Brooklyn. I didn't have a dishwasher. The one I had used was my parents' dishwasher that was very old. I'd never used a pod before. I remember the whole day being like, "I am so busted. I don't know how to do this."
Angela [00:22:09] That's amazing.
Jenny [00:22:11] Yeah, but it was a good way to make money while I was doing standup. My first audition for anything (I believe) that I got was the show "Bored to Death," which starred. Jason Schwartzman and Ted Danson and Zach Galifianakis. And that was my first job.
Jenna [00:22:26] Wow.
Jenny [00:22:27] Yeah.
Jenna [00:22:28] So at that time, Jason Schwarzman and Ted Danson were Ted Danson and Jason Schwartzman, but Zach Galifianakis was still kind of coming up, right?
Jenny [00:22:38] Yeah, I believe it was the year before "The Hangover" came out.
Jenna [00:22:43] Yeah. So I'm just curious, I've worked with a few of those guys and they're so talented and you walk on the set, like, what was that like? Do you remember?
Jenny [00:22:52] I definitely remember because first of all, my best friend is married to Zach and I didn't tell them that I was auditioning for the show because I just felt embarrassed. First of all, I don't really like asking for favors, I guess? I just, and I don't know... Like, what if I was bad? And then I'm not sure they could have helped me get on the show. But I got this part. Now I actually have to tell them, weirdly, that I'm showing up at Zach's job. It was supposed to be only... I was going to play this cashier and it was a smaller part and then they made it bigger because it actually was so fun and went very well, which is kind of every actor's dream. But I just remember, I was a huge Jason fan and I'm from Boston, like Ted Danson. "Cheers?" That's crazy.
Angela [00:23:42] I mean, yeah.
Jenny [00:23:42] It's just crazy. I just remembered being like, "Just don't say anything. Just don't do anything, don't say anything. Just do your lines and just don't be weird." You know? Which is a terrible plan. I don't even know what that says about what I thought of myself. What ended up happening was that I was so, so, so, so nervous. But the second I started talking to Jason, who's very kind and friendly, the nervousness changed to total excitement that I was actually there. You know? I kind of expected someone to be like, "Get out." Like, "Fan on the field," you know? "Get her out of here. Why is this person here?" I just remember having the real dreamy feeling of like, "Wow, I've actually crossed through the curtain into the dreamscape and I'm one of the actors on the show. And nobody knows that I don't know any of the lingo."Someone was like, "So this is your mark." I didn't know that people in a scene on TV don't just walk around wherever they want. I had never been on camera, other than a Cascade commercial in a studio where they just put me in front of the dishwasher and I just opened it. I genuinely had no idea what I was doing. I didn't know what my mark was and I didn't know what coverage was. I didn't know, like, "Okay, this is your side of the conversation. The camera's on you." You can't interrupt, necessarily, if they're not looking for crosstalk. I did not know what I doing and everybody was really, really nice to me. It was a real high. It just felt crazy. I kind of couldn't believe it. And honestly, when I think back on it now, I still feel like it's just a great stroke of luck.
Angela [00:25:25] I mean so much of it feels that way, right? I mean it's like, just being in the right place at the right time.
Jenny [00:25:30] Yeah.
Angela [00:25:30] But also, you had done the work. It's not by chance, but it is. Do you know what I mean?
Jenny [00:25:36] Yeah.
Angela [00:25:36] It's kind of hard to describe. Because for all the things to line up, you have to show up. You have to do a good job. But I always think about that, especially coming up in improv and performing with so many amazingly talented people who never got that lineup. Of all the things lining up and they're so talented. You know?
Jenny [00:25:53] There's just no short bets at all. I could have done all of that and it just maybe didn't go my way. I feel very aware of that still. I didn't have a five-year plan coming out of college, but maybe I should have looking back. [laughs]
Angela [00:26:10] I know. I didn't have a backup plan. I think sometimes that's maybe a good thing. Do you know what I mean?
Jenna [00:26:15] I do. Yeah, I think not having a safety net can be good when you're pursuing an artistic life. Was there a risk that you took early in your career that particularly paid off?
Jenny [00:26:27] Ooh, yeah, I think so. I mean, everything is risk. Everything still is risk, you know? I think it's kind of embarrassing to look back on the ways that I was like, "I'll just put on this wig and get out there." Just so un-self-conscious. But I think the risk that had the most effect was probably doing the movie, "Obvious Child," which was one of the first films I was in. Maybe it was the third? It was a real indie, like, a real Indie Indie. We are filming in the producer's house. I'm wearing the director's clothes. Just very, very little money. I mean, now I even think the conversation is incredibly different because reproductive justice and abortion rights are so restricted. But at the time it was still was like, "Oh, this is a movie about a comedian who gets an abortion and it's not joking about abortion." It's taking women's health seriously but it's still really funny. I just felt like, "Whoa. Who knows what this will be like? Who knows who these people are, that I'm working with?" And it just was so small. I genuinely did it because I wanted to do dramatic work and it came to me. I had done the short film of it, which I don't feel like was a big risk. That was just kind of fun and it normal and small, but I didn't really know what I was doing. I didn't know how to do a dramatic scene. I didn't go to acting school. I think the biggest risk for me was that I've always thought I could do this. What if I get there and I find out that I was completely wrong? That seems that it could happen. And instead, the people that I made that film with became my best friends. They've directed and produced all of my comedy specials and I've worked with them many times over and Liz, who produced that film, and she also produced "Marcel, the Shell with Shoes On: the Movie." It just paid off in so many social and professional ways, for sure.
Jenna [00:28:24] Well, that is the movie that put you on my radar.
Jenny [00:28:28] Oh, really?
Jenna [00:28:29] Yes, yes. I absolutely loved that movie, and you definitely delivered. You won a Critics' Choice Award for it.
Angela [00:28:37] Mm-hmm.
Jenny [00:28:38] That's true, yeah.
Angela [00:28:38] Best Actress in a Comedy, yeah.
Jenny [00:28:40] Jenna, I do remember you getting in touch with me about it, I think. Maybe it was on Instagram, or maybe we had an exchange, but I actually do remember being like, "I thinks that she likes our movie."
Jenna [00:28:51] I might have slid into your DMs. Jake Lacy (from The Office) is in that movie,
Jenny [00:28:57] Oh my gosh, yeah of course.
Jenna [00:28:57] and he had told me about it. And I was like, "I got to see this movie. It sounds so interesting." And it is. And it's all the things you said. It's a really grounded, cool conversation, but then also really, really funny. And you gave the character just... Oh, God, she was just so real. I love that movie.
Jenny [00:29:19] I'm glad. Thank you.
Angela [00:29:20] Yeah, you just saw such humanity in your performance, you were so honest and it was really beautiful. When we knew you were gonna come on the podcast, both Jenna and Matt were like, "Ange, you have to see 'Obvious Child." That's the one I hadn't seen and it is really wonderful.
Matt [00:29:38] It's the best movie ever. It's so... It really is just one of my favorites.
Sam [00:29:43] Yeah, I just want to pile on. I love that movie. You're great in it.
Jenny [00:29:46] Gosh, thank you.
Angela [00:29:47] I do want to take us back to 2010 because how I first got to know you was "Marcel the Shell with Shoes On." I watched all of them. I mean, my friends and I would send them to each other. There was a line... Oh it's something like, "Do you want to know how I put my skis on top of my car?" And you're like, "With a hair." I don't know you guys, I'm doing horrible. I'm doing you to you. This is so embarrassing.
Jenny [00:30:11] No, no, no.
Angela [00:30:12] There were so many. I love "Do you wanna guess?" All the ways... I don't know I just thought that was brilliant and then I thought it was so cool that it became a movie and it got nominated for an Academy Award. As someone that was a fan of it from that very beginning, amazing.
Jenny [00:30:30] Thank you. That's also a good example of a thing that you do. It actually didn't feel like a risk because it was something that my ex-husband and I just did for fun, you know? There was a small comedy show that asked him to make a video. So he was like, "Maybe I'll do that for that." But we were not... I mean, I didn't even know what Vimeo was then. I think it was pre-Instagram, maybe. So the idea of a content creator at that time just wasn't... Nobody would know what that was. That wasn't a term, or at least not one that was in the zeitgeist or had the function that it has now. We just did it for fun. I think there are so many questions in it because we were trying to find out who this character is and then we realized that it's just such a funny game to describe his life because he's so small. The way that he has to live his life is that he's made to be inventive. He has to, in order to survive and it's a pure thing that we did. It is astounding that it just sort of kept developing and it also took a long time. The movie took us seven years to make, and... I think it came out probably a decade (even more than a decade) after we made the first short. We really did not jump on that.
Jenna [00:31:49] I love that he's a little snail and it took a long time for him to get to everyone's screens.
Jenny [00:31:56] [giggling] Yeah.
Jenna [00:31:56] It was slow.
Jenny [00:31:58] He just had to walk there, it was a really long trip.
Angela [00:32:01] With this dog that's just lint.
Jenny [00:32:03] Yeah, Alan.
Angela [00:32:10] Well, I mean, my gosh, there's just so much. Jenny, what you've created is just really astounding. It's really amazing. Because you're a multi hyphenate, right? I always tell Jenna, "I want to be a multi-hyphenate" on Wikipedia. But you're a multi-hyphenant and you have this book that you just wrote called "Lifeform." Do you want to share with us about that?
Jenny [00:32:32] Yeah, sure. Lifeform is my second book. It's a book of small pieces that describe the five-year period in my life between when I was single, right? At the edge of my final single moments right before I met my now-husband Ben and all the way through pregnancy and having a baby and being with the baby and then ongoing. I think I started to write little pieces while I was pregnant. I don't know if this is a common feeling, but maybe a common fear, "Will this be all I am and do?" "Is this gonna be the thing that people ask me about the most, being pregnant or being a mother?" I think because of that, I wanted to see the greater arc of what my experience was so that I could prove to myself, like "Of course everything is connected. Of course we have things that stand out, or the moments that are the most impactful, but it is all connected and you stay you while you also change." And I think that's, in a sort of playful way, what the book represents. But that said, then I was like, "I should have done more pregnancy writing, I still want to reflect on it." One of the things I'm really excited about right now is my friends, Rebecca Dinerstein and Julie Bunton (who are these incredible novelists), put together an anthology called "Notes to New Mothers," which is just a beautiful book of all different contributors: all of these different people who are experiencing motherhood. And I've recently contributed to that.
Angela [00:34:01] Oh, nice.
Jenny [00:34:02] Yeah, that book is out now, but it is something that like... If you have any listeners that are new mothers ,or about to be mothers, or have a mother that they wanna get to know, it's like an encyclopedia of experiences and in so many different voices and so many different forms.
Jenna [00:34:17] Do you know what that's bringing up in me? I'm getting a little emotional as you talk about this. It's how, as a child, I think maybe you don't see your mom as a whole person. You really just see your Mom as your Mom. But your Mom is a whole person. Then for me, as a Mom, everything you just said. Like, I'm still a whole person with other thoughts and ideas and aspirations. So I love the idea of this book of essays that sort of put into context that idea. Am I making sense?
Jenny [00:34:54] Completely. Mothers can kind of be made flat, or just defined in one way. But actually, at least in my experience, the experience is deeply personal. Even though if you become a parent, you're part of a really, really vast collective, of course. But the personal parts of it are the ones that can make you sometimes feel really isolated. They're sometimes really hard to describe. They're also the things that are really, really unique that you might seek to preserve. Your own perceptions as a parent and as a human being. I think the reason why my own book, Lifeform, and this new collection that I added pieces to, Notes to New Mothers... I feel like it's so important to have as many different styles and as many examples as possible. Not just so that more of us can connect, but that you can get out of your own rut of personal definition. I always wanna be offered different ways to define myself and to not get stuck in an old definition that maybe I put on myself because I'm hard on myself, or I'm critical or I, you know, whatever. But yeah, I guess I just didn't realize that my view of my own mom would change so much once I became a parent.
Angela [00:36:15] Yeah. Exactly.
Jenny [00:36:16] I'm just like, Jesus Christ, you worked so hard.
Angela [00:36:19] So hard
Jenna [00:36:20] I called my mom the other day and I said to her, I was like, "Mom, did you used to go at the beginning of the school year and weed out all the clothes that were stained and didn't fit me anymore? And then put my back to school shopping clothes in my drawer for me? Because I didn't do it." I thought of it because I had just done it for my own kids. And I was like, "Oh my God, I did not see her do this. I had no awareness." But I also didn't have a dresser filled with 18 years of clothes. So someone did it. I know my dad didn't do it. But I just wanted to say, I'm really deeply moved by your book.
Jenny [00:37:00] Oh I'm glad.
Jenna [00:37:00] So I am really excited about these books.
Angela [00:37:04] We'll definitely share them with our listeners and put little swipe ups on where people can get them.
Jenny [00:37:10] Oh please do.
Angela [00:37:10] And, you know, a mother's journey never ends. I was just home with my mom, who's 88, and we were doing some laundry. My mom's pretty even-keeled. I was like, "You remember that one time you were so frustrated and you just started throwing everyone's laundry down the hallway?" We both just started laughing and we don't even remember what it was about. I'm sure none of us were doing our laundry and it was all piling up and so she just had it. But you just see them as just such just real people, you know? I think as she's getting older all those moments of us just laughing our butts off about some moment. It's just like, pile the treasures and keep them close, you know?
Jenny [00:37:54] Oh my God. My mom is somebody who... She's not a big comedy fan. She doesn't need that in her life. It's just not her deal. I'm not offended by it at all. It's not what she goes towards. She doesn't even really watch TV at all, actually. She'll watch "Masterpiece Theater." But to get my mom to laugh, it's just rare. It's so rare. I've tried, directly, to make her laugh and maybe that won't do it. But my sisters and I were talking about... I ended up at a very expensive dollhouse store with my daughter recently and it blew my mind. I felt very upset about it, that it was just so expensive. I just was like, "This is not how much this stuff costs. It doesn't. It just... It doesn't. I'm looking on Etsy. It doesn't cost this much." I felt very upset about it. I was telling my sisters like, "Man, it was just crazy." All I said was, "I remember one time when we went with Nana and Papa to the dollhouse store on the Cape and I really wanted this miniature glazed Thanksgiving turkey." And my mom, she's did a spit take. She was drinking sangria, I mean maybe that's why it happened. But to make her laugh was so gratifying. Now, generally, I want to do nice things for my mom. I didn't understand how much pressure she was under, at all. I definitely didn't.
Angela [00:39:16] That is so relatable. Obviously, I was so excited for my family to see The Office, you know? But my mom, to get her to laugh... It's like we just saw a rare animal in the wild, you know?
Jenny [00:39:33] Yeah.
Angela [00:39:34] Everyone comes running. But it was interesting, though. She did love The Office. But not at first. She didn't watch it at first, but the things she found funny were... Like, she loved Phyllis.
Jenny [00:39:45] Yeah, I mean, it's all perfect.
Angela [00:39:48] Anyway, we were going to ask you some questions: if you watched The Office, if there was a character you identified with?
Jenny [00:39:55] I just have something that I really need you to know. And I've said this to Ed Helms. I watched The Office when it was on TV. I always loved it. It always was perfect to me. There was one point where I auditioned for it and I didn't get it.
Angela [00:40:11] What role?
Jenny [00:40:11] It was like, do you remember Dwight, he has an intern? But I don't remember what the name of the part was, I just remember being like, "Oh my God, this is a huge deal" and then not getting it. But I always loved it, always. I'm always the person watching it on a plane. I know all the episodes and I'm still watching it, but it had a complete renaissance, a complete new meaning, complete new power for me and my husband. Because when I had my daughter, which was December of 2020, so I was pregnant for the whole start of the pandemic. I gave birth in a mask.
Angela [00:40:51] Oh my gosh.
Jenny [00:40:52] None of my family was there. We were really, really by ourselves. But every day at, like, 4:45PM, we would be like, "And the walking part of the day is over, we're done. We're getting in bed." We would order takeout and watch The Office. Like many new parents, I was so tired. I was just so anxious. I was really happy to be doing what I was doing, but it was a lot. To be able to laugh that hard and we craved the show. We were just looking at the clock being like, "It's like 4:30PM, can we get in bed?" We watched season after season. We would watch so many episodes in a night. We would watch it until one of us just put the baby in her little snoo thing. It soothed us to sleep. But then if we fell asleep, we would go back and we would watch the episode that we fell sleep on. It was the most comforting, rejuvenating thing. It truly gave our family so much joy. I really like thinking that my daughter, when she was first in this world, heard me and my husband laugh so much. It is because of the show. I know that's so cheesy, but it's really true. Really true. It just means so much to me, your work and the show and I love it so much and thank you.
Jenna [00:42:15] Thank you.
Angela [00:42:16] Jenny, my gosh, that's so wonderful.
Jenny [00:42:18] It's really real.
Jenna [00:42:19] I was really pregnant with my son in that later season of The Office, and I would go into work and I will laugh all day and I think to myself, "This has gotta be so good for him. He just is getting all the laughter and joy. He's just hearing me laugh all day. This is so cool." So I know what you're talking about.
Jenny [00:42:41] Yeah. Hopefully it makes up for the months of crazy COVID, listening to podcasts, listening to the news being like, "And we are not out of this at all."
Jenna [00:42:57] I'm so glad. Do you have a favorite episode or character that you particularly gravitated toward?
Jenny [00:43:04] Oh my God. I mean, I have a niche secret favorite. You know, Mark Proksch? In the warehouse, when he's just like, [starts laughing]. That character just really kills me. But I mean I don't know if people say this. It's really, really, really, really, really hard to pick a fave. I'm a big Michael fan, even though he often makes me feel really upset and uncomfortable. I also love the episode where he and Toby, like, Toby sort of tricks him into doing kid therapy.
Jenna [00:43:42] Yeah.
Jenny [00:43:43] Where it's like... I forget that Michael's stepdad's name. But Michael's like, "My mom, she spent a lot of time with Jeff."
Angela [00:43:51] Yeah, it's Jeff.
Jenny [00:43:52] "Oh, who's Jeff?" And they're playing a board game and he's just like, "Jeff, I mean he's okay." It's just so funny and I mean... I don't know... I can't they're all... The CPR episode where Kelly starts dancing. That is such a funny joke. The episode where Andy says, "Beer, beer me a water."
Jenna [00:44:15] Well, you do have an Office connection through Mike Schur,
Jenny [00:44:19] That's true!
Jenna [00:44:19] Because you we're on "Parks and Rec." Can we talk about Parks and Rec for a hot second before we let you go? I love Mona Lisa. "Money, money, money."
Angela [00:44:28] "Money, please." Mona Lisa is just... I mean, I know so many people have talked to you about that "Don't be suspicious," but there's some things that come on you're just like, "I'm gonna watch that and I've watched it a gazillion times but I'm going to watch it again because it makes me laugh every time?" If I am scrolling anywhere and that comes up, it makes me so happy every time.
Jenny [00:44:50] Oh, I'm really glad. That part was written for me by my friend Joe Mandy. He was like, "I wrote a weird part, will you come and do it?" I certainly didn't expect that to be a thing, at all. I really enjoyed it. I am sure they have 20 million hours of just garbage. Like, stuff that hit the cutting room floor because Ben and I would not shut up. Like, we just couldn't stop.
Jenny [00:45:26] Also, I didn't even get to the Angela and Pam of my favorites. Especially Angela's trysts, her uptight tryst with Dwight. hose moments are just... Especially just because physically you're so tiny and he's so tall. Also, there are so many funny Pam moments. But the episode where you go across the coals, which is more of a dramatic one. That makes me cry so much. When you tell Jim that you used to be best friends and you're not anymore and then it ends in the kiss, that is one of the best episodes of TV, just to say. I love it so much. God d**n.
Jenna [00:46:08] We were very lucky.
Angela [00:46:10] We were.
Jenna [00:46:10] Really lucky.
Jenny [00:46:47]Michael has a lot of pairings that offset him. Like, there's Michael and Dwight and Michael and Holly and the Michael and Pam. Pam just really having to take it in and often having to do things that are just so inane. It's so satisfying, that just takes an insane amount of nuance and talent. Anyway, I could truly talk to you guys about this forever.
Angela [00:47:17] Well, thank you so much for saying all that. I really related to something you said at the top, which is that I never saw myself as the bitch. So when I got casted, it was so surprising. My mom says I either play the bitch or the weirdo. She's very eager for me to play someone like, I guess... I don't know, whatever. But you know, Jenny you can come back anytime. Anything you want to talk about, come back, because this was so fun.
Jenny [00:47:46] Thank you so much for having me. It's really, really a highlight of my experience here on Earth, that I got to do this.
Angela [00:50:23] Okay, great. Well, thanks so much, Jenny.
Jenna [00:50:25] Jenny, thank you so much.
Jenny [00:50:27] Thank you both. Oh my gosh, I really, really appreciate everything. Thank you for having me and it's been a pleasure.
Angela [00:50:33] Hugs, hugs, and we'll share all the things.
Jenny [00:50:35] Okay, cool.
Angela [00:50:36] Okay.
Jenny [00:50:37] Bye.
Jenna [00:50:37] Bye!
Jenna [00:00:17] Thank you for listening to Office Ladies.
Angela [00:00:19] Office Ladies is a presentation of Audacy and is produced by Jenna Fischer and Angela Kinsey.
Jenna [00:00:24] Our senior producer is Matt Beagle amd Our audio engineer is Sam Kieffer
Angela [00:00:32] Audacy's executive producer is Leah Reis-Dennis.
Jenna [00:00:35] Office Ladies was mixed and mastered by Bill Schultz.
Angela [00:00:37] Our theme song is "Rubber Tree" by Creed Bratton.